Although I may take issue on occasion with third-party coin grading companies, including top-rated PCGS and NGC, they and the other top-tier services (ANACS and ICG) are essential when you think you may have purchased a counterfeit coin.
Counterfeits are growing increasingly common in estate and online auctions, especially through portals such as Proxibid, iCollector and eBay, which feature hundreds of rare-coin auctions every day (if not every hour).
I’m an experienced numismatist who knows counterfeiting basics, but often those are insufficient when you cannot inspect a coin close-up. Moreover, when auctioneers state that all sales are final, you had better approach them with proof that the coin you won is a fake.
That’s when third-party graders can help your case.
You’ll have to prove that case within 45 days if you purchased a coin on eBay using PayPal. I confronted that policy when I submitted a medieval gold piece through my local dealer to NGC. Dealers typically wait until they have at least five coins to submit. That can take a few weeks. Then add the usual 30-day turn-around time, and it’s easy to surpass the eBay/PayPal limit.
So PayPal was no help in refunding my purchase.
Luckily in this case, the seller offered to pay the difference between the gold weight and the final sale.
Since that transaction, though, I do not buy many rare coins, especially gold, from eBay unless they come in third-party holders (and even those can be fake, but rarely so).
My latest counterfeit purchase happened in a recent Proxibid auction conducted by a dealer in my home state of Iowa.
The issue with this particular coin, a $2.50 Indian gold piece, was difficult to detect via the Web. I questioned its authenticity as soon as I inspected it first-hand and then brought it to my local coin shop owner, Scott Nichols, who immediately sensed a problem, too. “There’s something wrong with the incuse,” he said, a clue that coin was a fake.
"Incuse" is a device, or image, that is minted into and below the surface of a coin, the opposite of “relief,” which is above the surface.
We sent it to NGC, and it came back as “not genuine.”
The coin appeared to be a 1960s-type Lebanese rather than Chinese fake, and it actually contained a few more grains of gold than the standard 64.5 grains of authentic strikes.
Fortunately, I knew the auctioneers who have promised a refund, including shipping.
Counterfeit detection is a skill that anyone bidding online or buying raw coins in person should learn. There are several books on the topic. My favorite is The Official Guide to Coin Grading and Counterfeit Detection, second edition, published by PCGS.
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I recently purchased two silver pandas that turned out to be silver plated copper. Pay pal said I could send them back. I told them I am not spending more money to send back a couple of counterfeit coins worth a couple of pennies, and I cut into them with a hack saw anyway.
The thing to do is go to your credit card company and refuse payment. Discover Card gives you six months to file a dispute. I sent them photos and a formal complaint that e bay continues to let these counterfeiters proliferate.
Thank you, Todd, for your comment. I was wondering about doing precisely what you suggest with my credit card company when PayPal offered me no assistance. The counterfeit situation is worsening, as your message also indicates.
I was wondering if anyone knows of any incidences where gold Eagles, Buffalos, Maples, or the
Aussie gold coins are being counterfeited & passed into the market. This concerns me because these products are what I am buying exclusively, either in bullion or uncirculated grades.
Thanks!
Counterfeit bullion coins like Eagles and Maples have been found but are somewhat rare. Some dealers who are expert counterfeit detectives say the cost of creating bullion at 70% or 80% gold is not worth the effort. (Sometimes the effort doesn’t matter as counterfeit Sacagawea dollars have been found, and my local dealer in Ames, Iowa, found a counterfeit George Washingon Carver commemorative in XF condition.) There have been reports, however, of mega-expensive gold-plated bars made of tungsten, approximately the same density as gold. Here’s a link: http://reasonradionetwork.com/?p=4867
I have a 1943 penny It has been sent to 3 grading places and all 3 say something different about the coin in a matter of it not being real when asked why it is not real none of them will tell me and one place didn’t even charge me and sent it back over nigh express which seamed odd and when I called because I wanted to know how they were able to tell as it passes all the test as being real and was sealed in a safe for 30+ years
I also know of people who sent coins in to pcgs and other places that were said “not genuine” then they held on to the coin for 6 months sent them back in and they came back as being “Genuine” I still believe it is real and it is so rare that the places don’t want their name on the line because of this
any idea what I should do?
Nate, I’m assuming your 1943 cent is copper, or appears to be copper. Those that prove genuine are exceedingly rare, as only about three dozen or so such examples left the mint after being struck on the wrong planchet.
There are many fakes for the copper 1943 cent, as you probably know. The old trick to check for authenticity is to use a magnet, because some 1943 steel cents were plated with copper. If the coin is attracted to the magnet, it’s one of those.
Were this my coin, though, my first thought would be that it is counterfeit. All sorts of people put coins in a safe without knowing their true worth. That said, your anecdote about sending it to three grading companies and all three saying something different, well, that’s just plain odd if you’re speaking about top-tier companies like NGC, PCGS, ANACS and ICG.
Keep in mind I’m not a grader, but I do know how graders operate when they discover a fake coin like a well-minted counterfeit gold dollar. Those coins will tend to have the same marks as the source coin from which the copy is made, and graders see copies regularly that fit that description.
Nonetheless, people do on occasion have rare finds in their possession. If I were as convinced as you that my 1943 cent was genuine, I would take it to a coin show large enough to host a table by one of the top grading companies, pay the premium price and ask pointed questions in person.
are un marked chines conter fit coins worth any thing
You should keep Chinese counterfeit coins and not put them in auctions or try to sell them. Even if you sell them as counterfeit, someone may decide to market them as authentic. Such coins are only worth their melt value. So yes, in a way, counterfeit coins have value if silver or gold (but most likely, the metal composition also has been compromised).
I was given a 1943 steal dime for a dime in change. is it counterfiet? or what is it worth? please call me if you can. thank you. 832-226-1479
Lee,
It is possible that your silver dime was minted by mistake on a 1943 steel-cent planchet. A silver (rather than steel) dime should weigh about 2.5 grams. A steel cent should weigh 2.689 grams. A dime from that year should have a reeded edge whereas a cent would lack that. Put your dime on top of a cent; if the dime is the same size, that could indicate the wrong planchet, too. Also, silver does not stick to magnets, but steel does; so you’ll want to test that.
If your dime weights about 2.6 grams, lacks a reeded edge, is about the same size as a cent, and is attracted by a magnet, you may have a rare mint error.
I would not be able to authenticate that type of coin, but you should send it into such a servic via your local coin dealer.
FInally, more common but still rare would be a 1944 cent struck on left-over steel cent planchets. I have not seen or heard about a 1943 dime struck on a steel planchet, but because steel and silver planchets are somewhat similar in color and weight, such a coin may exist.
I have a coin penny dated 1944 how can I know if my penny is real it is with me around 10 years
A 1944 coin is common, with 1,435,400,000 minted that year. Is there something unusual about it, say, minted on a 1943 steel planchet?
Great to find this blog. I’m a 60 yr old widow who has been buying physical gold and silver–1 oz and 1/10 oz gold eagles, 1 oz silver eagles, and the old dimes, qtrs, halves and dollars since 2005. I’m becoming increasingly uneasy about authenticity as more and more stories abound of counterfeits out there. I have too many coins to send for grading so what can I do. It’s too late in most instances to confront the thieves if some are counterfeit. But for my peace of mind I would like to have someone look them over. Any suggestions? A local coin dealer?
Liz,
Thank you for writing. Counterfeits are a problem. My coin dealer purchased a set of gold pandas and sent them in for grading, only to learn they were counterfeit. So even dealers can be fooled. But not often on most fake coins.
I’m not so concerned about silver and gold eagles. There’s not much money in faking those, given the metal involved. Silver eagles have a reeded edge and should be 99.93 percent silver. That means each should weigh 31.1 grams. A 1/10th ounce gold eagle also should have a reeded edge and weigh 3.39 grams. It’s content is 91.67 percent gold, 3 percent silver, and 5.33 percent copper. You can weigh those coins yourself by purchasing a coin scale from your dealer.
Concerning your other coins and rounds, I would bring a random sample to your local dealer and have him look them over. Ask what he would pay for them, if you sold them. No need to mention counterfeit because dealers are always on the lookout for fakes. If the dealer gives a good offer, consider selling and if not, just thank the dealer for his time.
(It’s important to patronize dealers so I would suggest making that visit and showing those coins the next time you decide to make a silver or gold purchase, and then do that from the local shop.)
Counterfeit coins are sold mostly online these days. If you purchased coins from online sellers, you might have their contact data on receipts. Always keep receipts.
I don’t recommend buying precious metals from unknown dealers online. Also, check in your area for a local coin club. There will be plenty of help there. I’m the president of the Ames, Iowa, Coin Club: http://www.amescoinclub.wordpress.com. You’re apt to find plenty of experts who will help you further.
Hi, I have afew silver panda coins, 2009. A couple of the coins have ///////// on the coins edge and a couple have llllllllll on the coins edge. Can they both be real panda coins or just one of them? I would not think that the different mints in China would make different coins, or do they? Thanks, Harold
Dear Harold,
Thanks for writing. You are right in wondering if your silver Pandas are real or fake, especially if you purchased them on eBay or from an online seller you did not know. I think those slash marks are posts that the Chinese government included so as to help distinguish real from phony Pandas.
At any rate, here are links to three excellent guides that will help you determine if your pandas are real:
1. http://reviews.ebay.com/How-to-spot-a-fake-silver-panda_W0QQugidZ10000000000966183
2. http://reviews.ebay.com/Counterfeit-Pandas-Chinese-Silver-and-Gold_W0QQugidZ10000000000935653
3. http://www.ngccoin.com/news/viewarticle.aspx?NewsletterNewsArticleID=67
In general, I am reluctant to purchase any coins made in China unless they are certified. While those coins are beautiful, the specter of counterfeits from China and that government’s reluctance to do anything about it have consequences.
Good luck with your coins.
I have a question. My husband bought counterfeit coins (we did not know they were counterfeit). I took them to a coin shop in town and he told me they were counterfeit. He also kept them and told me that he would not give them back to me and I could call the cops but they would just take me to jail. Is this true? Did he have the right to take the coins?
Angie,
There is no law against owning a counterfeit coin. There are laws about knowingly trying to sell them.
Many coin dealers keep counterfeit coins to compare against suspected ones arriving in their shop.
Check out this article: http://www.anacs.com/contentPages/CounterfeitCoins.aspx
The last paragraph is particularly telling.
I never heard of a coin dealer confiscating counterfeit coins. I can’t give legal advice, but you may want to contact an attorney if the coins had value, such as gold content.
Michael
I bought a coin from an estate auction for about 9 dollars. The coin was worth 35 dollars. The coin was a 1858 Quarter Dollar. I sold it and the buyer received it and opened up a ebay case saying it was fake. I gave him a refund and he sent it back. When i got it back i checcked it. I weighted it and it was very light, only about 4 1/2 grams. There is no line on the edge and theres a rim. The actually color of the metal was a greyish and it has a very little bit of iron in it (Making it a little magnetic, but not enough to move it). The rim has some extra metal between the reeding. I think it is a very old counterfeit. Maybe dated back into the 1800′s? Does it have any value to it?
Thank you for writing me, Tim. Indeed, counterfeits are as old as Bunker Hill in America (metaphorically). Generally, fake coins are illegal to sell but not illegal to own. Here’s a very good article on the fascinating world of counterfeits: http://rg.ancients.info/bogos/
I have a collection of doctored coins. I won’t sell them, though. If I ever do, it will be for their metal content rather than numismatic worth.
Hope this helps!